Tim Ulbrich and Tony Umholtz explore the costs, benefits, and personal meaning of homeownership and how to decide whether buying fits your life.
Episode Summary
Is buying a home still a good investment? In this episode of Scripted Wealth: Money & Meaning for Pharmacists, Tim Ulbrich, PharmD welcomes back Tony Umholtz, Senior Vice President of Mortgage Banking at First Horizon, to explore the financial and personal value of homeownership. They discuss renting versus buying, the costs beyond your mortgage payment, and how waiting for lower interest rates can shape your decisions. From building equity to creating memories and finding community, this conversation will help you consider how a home fits into your finances and the life you want to build.
What you’ll learn in this episode:
- How to weigh renting versus buying based on your timeline, location, and financial goals.
- Why waiting for a return to pandemic-era mortgage rates may keep your home buying plans on hold.
- How to account for property taxes, insurance, maintenance, and repairs beyond your mortgage payment.
- How equity, appreciation, and potential tax benefits factor into the financial side of homeownership.
- Why stability, community, and personal meaning deserve a place alongside the numbers.
Mentioned in Today’s Episode
- Tony Umholtz (First Horizon) Website
- Tony Umholtz (First Horizon) Email: tony.umholtz@firsthorizon.com
- YFP Gives
- YFP Wealth
Episode Transcript
Tim: [00:00:00] When I think about the value of our home, you know, sure, I love the financial appreciation. I love it for all the, the reasons we just talked about, but when I’m going back looking through pictures, right, it’s the memories that we’re, we’re creating in the home. It’s the experiences. It’s the investment in, in remodeling our basement so that, you know, my, my oldest three can hang out and sleep there every night and, and get some good bro time, right, and have friends over.
And we have community that, that we’re in, and people that you just feel seen and, and loved by. And it’s all these other, you know, aspects that you can’t put into a home purchase calculator. Um, a- and th- this is why I, I so strongly feel that for those that this is a goal, let’s prioritize that
Home Buying Myth Busting
Tim: Welcome to Scripted Wealth: Money and Meaning for Pharmacists, where we explore not only the financial decisions that pharmacists face, but also the stories, the values, and the assumptions that are shaping those decisions. And today, we’re talking about one of the largest [00:01:00] purchases most of us will make during our lifetime, and that is buying a home.
We’re often told, or at least many of us are told, that renting is throwing money away, that home ownership is one of the best ways to build wealth, and that buying a house represents an important step towards financial success. But in today’s market, that question is top of mind more than it’s ever been in recent history.
Is It Worth It?
Tim: Is purchasing home really a great investment? When we honestly account for the mortgage interest, the property taxes, the insurance, the maintenance, the renovations, the transaction costs, and of course, the opportunity cost of how we could use that money that we put into the home elsewhere, the financial return, at least quantitatively speaking, may be less compelling than we think.
And yet, that doesn’t mean that buying a home shouldn’t be a primary goal for many. When I think about my own home, I don’t primarily think about [00:02:00] it as an investment return. Sure, I would love to see the appreciation as we have since buying our home in 2018. I think about it as a safe and secure place for our family, the memories that we’ve made in our home, our connection to our community and our neighborhood and behind, beyond, and having a place where we can rest, where we can gather, and we can feel rooted And so even if another decision might have produced a better return on a spreadsheet, I wouldn’t have changed the decision we made to purchase a home.
And so this raises the question that’s at the center of today’s conversation: Does a home have to be a great financial investment to be worth buying?
Meet Tony Umholtz
Tim: And joining me to explore that question is a familiar voice to many in the YFP community, and that’s Tony Umholtz, Senior Vice President of Mortgage Banking at First Horizon.
Tony has spent decades helping individuals and families navigate home financing, and he brings both extensive technical knowledge [00:03:00] and a front-row view of what home ownership means to the people pursuing it. In addition to being today’s guest, Tony is also a lead sponsor of our nonprofit, YFP Gives, which supports scholarships, financial literacy, and pharmacist-led giving.
Tony’s been a longtime supporter of the YFP community and a trusted resource for pharmacists financing a home or investment property. Through First Horizon’s Medical Professional Loan Program, pharmacists can access up to 100% financing on loan amounts up to $2 million with no private mortgage insurance.
The program is available across the lower 48 states and is designed specifically with medical professionals, including pharmacists, in mind. To learn more or to connect with Tony directly, we’ll put a link in the show notes. You can also email Tony at tony.umholtz@firsthorizon.com. We’re grateful to Tony and First Horizon for supporting YFP Gives and the pharmacists that we serve.
[00:04:00] Tony, welcome back to the show.
Tony: Hey, Tim. Great to see you. Great to be with all of you guys. It’s great to be back
Tim: We’re gonna dive into an exciting conversation around the quantitative and the qualitative value of homeownership. And, and of course, I’m gonna bring my own experiences. I suspect you’re gonna bring your own experiences to the discussion as well, not only as a homeowner, but also as somebody who is able to serve and help people through the financing, uh, process of purchasing a home.
2026 Market Snapshot
Tim: Before we get into that, the question I always like to start our discussions with, which is, Tony, help me make sense of what is going on in the home purchase market here at the time of this recording in, in the early fall of 2026.
Tony: It’s been an interesting year, Tim, it really has. I’ve– You know, it’s, it’s– and, and every market’s a little different, but on average, you know, there’s a little bit more inventory out there, you know, for buyers, which has been good. Um, and of course, interest rates been, been tricky this year. We started the year, [00:05:00] interest rates were really falling.
In fact, in January, February, we saw some of the lowest rates we’ve seen in, in– since twenty twenty-two. And I actually got some folks refinanced that moved quickly, but unfortunately, those rates just started shooting up from there. And, um, you know, between the inflation and there’s a lot of other things underlying this.
I don’t wanna, uh, that, you know, us supporting the, the yen, Japan, what’s going on over in Japan. There’s a lot of things that have, have caused treasury rates to go up, which of course pushes mortgage rates up too. But there– we had a pretty healthy spring, pretty active spring. Um, there is still some opportunity as– for home buyers. But what I do like is it’s, it’s easier. There’s more inventory in most parts of the, the market. And we’re still seeing a good amount of activity on home prices under eight hundred thousand. So it’s still been a, a, a fairly strong year in that, in that regard
Waiting for Low Rates
Tim: One of the things I’m gonna come back to as we get towards the end of the show and, and hopefully kind [00:06:00] of bring all of this discussion together is that, you know, the more I think about the conversations I’m having with pharmacists that are looking to purchase a home, that could be a first-time purchase, that could be a, “Hey, we bought a starter home 10 years ago, and we’ve been thinking about, you know, moving or upgrading, and we just have been dragging our feet on that because we got a low interest rate.”
Um, it could be somebody who’s downsizing in retirement. It, it feels like, and I’d love your perspective on this, it feels like we’re stuck in this mindset, especially for those that lived through the low interest rate environment. Uh, you know, thinking about the early pandemic years, high twos, the low threes, a lot of people refinanced or people that purchased.
And even though we can zoom out and know that historically that is not represented, uh, representative of, of interest rates, we’re, we’re hanging on to that point in time, and we’re seeing that trickle, I think… You’re, you’re much closer to this than I am. I’d love to hear your perspective. We’re seeing that translate even down to [00:07:00] a next generation of home buyers that wouldn’t even have experienced that low interest rate environment, but they’ve, they’ve heard of it, right?
And there’s this, I think, unrealistic expectation of, “Hey, it’s gonna come back,” or, “I’m gonna wait, and we’re gonna see what’s happening.” We’ve talked about this for four or five years now on the show and the market that we’re in, and sure enough, three, four, five years goes by and we’re waiting. Interest rates haven’t budged.
We’ve seen some cycles. You mentioned a couple of those in, in your comments. But what has happened is those homes have appreciated, uh, and probably rent prices have appreciated while, while people are in those situations as well. And so the point I’m making here is I, I firmly believe that we have to go back to the goals, and why do we wanna buy a home?
What, what is the purpose? What’s the point? What’s the focus of the home purchase? And then if that’s a goal, the market conditions are the market conditions. They might change in a year, they might change in 10 years, they might stay kinda stuck where we are for a longer period of time. But if that [00:08:00] truly is a goal, just like any other goal, how do we build the financial plan around it to support that?
And I’d love to just hear your, your thoughts on that, Tony, of, you know, are, are we seeing people, are you seeing people that are, that are hanging on to a time period that has now been five years ago , you know, expecting something to change that we’re just not seeing that budge?
Time in the Market
Tony: You know, you know, Tim, I, I, I have been. It’s interesting. I’ve seen it a lot too with buyers who participated during that time as well, that, that need a bigger home or have an, a job opportunity where it would be better for them to move, and they’ll call saying, “I, I still have that rate that you wrote for me in the high twos or three– mid-threes.” And the home doesn’t fit them anymore, and the rates are higher. But to your point, wouldn’t be in a sustainable environment if rates were still at that level ‘ cause r- the prices of real estate would just be as- you know, astronomical. Instead of averaging maybe [00:09:00] four to six percent a year in appreciation, we’d be double-digit appreciation. It would really become unaff- truly unaffordable, um, and we’d be in bubble territory. So when the rates went up like they did, it did slow some of the appreciation down. It made it a, a… The inventory, there was no inventory during COVID, during those low interest rates. I remember in between twenty twenty, second half of twenty twenty and even twenty twenty-two, buyers could not find property.
It was very, very difficult. You were waiving your inspection rights, sometimes having to waive appraisals, pay, pay more than the house was worth. It wasn’t normal. Now you’re in a more normal environment, even in an environment where a buyer can benefit. So financially, I think even though rates are higher, there, there’s definitely some positives from a financial standpoint. But I do hear from cl- from clients who are new to the market and they say, “Hey, I wish they were this… rates were, you know, where w- I could’ve bought five, six years ago.” But every cycle’s different, and longevity in the market’s the [00:10:00] key for homeownership. the longer you own that home, the better off you’re gonna be. And there’s so many aspects to the, to the, that you referenced in the beginning of this call, Tim. I mean, uh, you can’t put a price on where you raise your family, the community you’re in, the friends you’re around, um, just, just the memories you make in a home and the things you can do to it. If you’re renting, you can’t paint your wall purple, right?
You could do it with, you know,
Tim: Yeah.
Tony: I’m not, not
Tim: Yeah
Tony: that, but you know what I mean. You can’t go paint a, a rental property any color you want, but you can in a, in, in your home. . You know, I’ve, I’ve owned homes since I was 24. I will admit I’ll be 50 in a few months, so I’ve been through a few cycles. Um, the, uh, uh… But I’ve seen benefits every time. And I did buy one home at the absolute worst time. I sold one home in 2006 and did well. It was a smaller home, and my wife and I were building a home after we were newly married, and it was the worst time.
But even [00:11:00] holding that home over time, we did, we did well. So that’s the key. A lot of it is time in the market.
Rent vs Buy Math
Tony: And one, one simple calculator, and I can, you know, just take a baseline of a $500,000 home. If you were to put 5% down, you know, just a simple 5% down payment, which many pharmacists have options to with no PMI, that’s a $20,000 down payment If the home goes up four percent on average, which is roughly the average amount, a twenty thousand dollar appreciation. Where, where can you get that kind of return on investment? When you, when you factor in leverage, that’s a hundred percent return on your equity. And real estate is powerful in that way. You can see the power of, of leverage, plus you’re paying down the principal every month, and you’ve got the tax benefits as well. there’s a lot of financial benefits to owning a home. And I even have a model that I used to run [00:12:00] all the time that I had a program for it and used it a lot ten, fifteen years ago, where I would compare a home that did not change in value, zero appreciation, and you renting, right? Rents always go up over time, even if it’s a steady increase. Usually, it’s at least three percent a year, sometimes five to ten, depending on
Tim: Yep.
Tony: So you look at that over time, and you look at the home price, right? Even if you had no appreciation, but with the tax benefits and the amortization of the note, over time, you would still be ahead with no appreciation, you’ve locked in your cost of, of ownership too. So there is a lot of benefit, but again, it’s over time. If you’re only gonna be there a few years, there’s more risk. You know, you could have– You, you know, I have one, one client I’ll just mention. He, he was actually a football coach. I did– helped him with a loan. He was– He, he bought during right before COVID, okay?
Right before COVID. He only lasted a couple years at his job. You know, that’s a volatile business. You don’t win, you’re
Tim: Yeah
Tony: but, but he, but he, but [00:13:00] he was one of those guys. Most of them rent. I usually tell most of those guys to rent because it’s only a two to three… You
Tim: Yeah
Tony: know how long you’re gonna be here. Well, he bought, but he, he bought the right time, right before COVID. He got– lost his job two years later, and, but he made such a huge return on his house. So it’s hard to time that up, but over time, you’re n-normally gonna do very, very well on a, on homeownership if you look at the long run. So that’s, that would be the key here
Tim: Yeah
Tony: perspective, is the long run. You know, I… If it’s th– If it’s under five years, th- under three years, I would not, I would rent. If it’s three to five years, it depends on the market you’re in. I, I… You could buy in certain cases where it’s a good market. Uh, but if you’re over five years, you know you’re gonna be there, it’s, it’s really a no-brainer to, to, to buy, ’cause renting’s gonna cost you a lot of money over time.
Tim: Yeah, and so we’re, we’re, we’re operating under the assumption, right, that most pharmacists are purchasing with a, you know, typically a 30-year fixed rate interest loan. [00:14:00] Some might do 15 or 20. And so we’re, we’re assuming that that principal and interest is a fixed payment. Um, for, for many pharmacists income’s gonna go up, you know, throughout their career, so as a percentage of your income, you know, that, that should get, you know, better over time, um, as your income goes up versus where you started.
Of course, there’s other costs involved that, that aren’t necessarily fixed, but compared to rent, you know, you look at it as a snapshot today there are, are situations certainly where maybe that monthly payment, you know, today may be fa- more favorable rent, but that, that’s not fixed, right? That’s not fixed over, you know, a period of time as you articulated, typically at least a 3% depending on the market.
And of course, that lives on, right? There i- there is a future day we hope on the home purchase that that mortgage will be paid off and there’s no more, at least on the principal and interest side. Uh, I’m so glad you said time in market, right? ‘Cause we talk about this a lot on the investing side. It’s not timing the market, but it’s time in the market, and I think the same is true with the home buying purchase.
I mean, [00:15:00] some people get lucky. You, you mentioned the example right there, right, with the, the football coach and right timing, right place. Even in a less than ideal situation where you could argue textbook answer is they should, they should rent, they’re in a state of transition, it was the right timing, but you only know that in hindsight, right?
And so that, that’s, that’s the sentiments I was making a little bit earlier of like, if this is a goal and we’ve clearly defined it as a goal and we’ve evaluated it, assuming that we, at least for what we know, we’re gonna have a long time in the market, you know, that’s where we wanna begin to, to evaluate that as a, as a broader part of the plan.
Now, just to reemphasize what you said, there, there are certain situations where renting may make sense. You know, I see this in, in some areas that are very, very, very high cost of living where homeownership may be unaffordable, right? I live in New York City or I live in San Fran or, you know, it i- it is what it is.
Um, and the purchase of the home may, may be out of reach. And then of course the state of transition, right? We see this a lot with, you know, pharmacists that [00:16:00] maybe are going through a transition from like a residency or a fellowship into their early working careers, or even in that first or second job, uh, and they’re still not quite landed on where they may be, you know, location-wise.
And just given the, the cost of the turnover, that becomes harder to have a long-term return on investment. And so just like, just like with any other part of the financial plan it comes down to your unique circumstances. But assuming we have a long time run in the market, I think you articulated really well what the value of that is, you know, for the long run, uh, financially speaking.
You did mention 4 to 6% is kind of a, a broad, um, rule of thumb I think you’re using for like annual appreciation of homes. Of c- of course market-specific, but is that what you just g- generally, you know, think of, uh, when, when you think about home appreciation?
Tony: I’m probably closer to 4%. I was– what, what I would average over the long run.
Tim: Yeah
Tony: if you look at a trend line, that’s probably safer. I think it’s between [00:17:00] 4% and 6% if you look at it, but I’m always a little more conservative. I’d say just use, you know, kind of a 4%
Tim: 4%. Yeah
Tony: but we’ve seen it, it’s, it, it, every, every area is different.
You
Tim: Mm-hmm.
Tony: I, I know areas, you know, I’m based in Florida, like we’ve mentioned before. I, I know parts of town here that have gone up double digits and some that have dropped double digits, you know, because it’s just, you know, are you in a flood zone? Yes. Are you th- you know,
Tim: Right?
Tony: things that impact a, you know, you know, impact properties as well.
But, uh, I’d say over time, um, that’s the, the appreciation rate you could, you could expect and model out.
Tim: Okay.
Hidden Costs and Budgeting
Tim: Now, to, to be fair to both sides of this discussion, right, we talked about the escalation in rent over time, whereas in the home purchase, your principal and interest is fixed, at least on a fixed loan. But even thinking about my own situation since we moved in, in, in 2018, principal and interest has been fixed, which is great, ’cause as my income has, has gone up over time, you know, that as a percentage [00:18:00] of take-home pay is, is smaller, um, in terms of the monthly payment.
But then I look at the other things, right? I think about property taxes. I think homeowners insurance. You know, property taxes has been on the rise here in Columbus. Homeowners insurance, I think for everyone nationwide, has been, been on the rise, um, as they’re looking at kinda spreading out tho- those costs.
Um, obviously upkeep and maintenance and, you know, the list goes on and on. And as we’ve talked about several times on the show before, as we’re making the decision to purchase a home, we have to look at not just that down payment, not just that principal and interest, but how does the entirety of the home purchase fit into the budget, and of course, all the other, all the other goals that, that are going on.
Tax Breaks and Equity
Tim: Um, Tony, I wanna talk about some of the other, uh, advantages that we think about. You mentioned tax advantages. Talk to us a little bit more. I was thinking about no- not, not only on the, the property tax side, but also on the eventual sale side, right? Depending on how much [00:19:00] appreciation has happened, it’s one of the rare vehicles we have out there, you know, that we can, uh, be able to sell, sell our home and have that equity be tax-free within certain limits.
So just ta- talk a little bit more about where you see the, the tax advantages coming in.
Tony: Yeah. That’s a great point, Tim. Uh, so if you’re, if you’re married, uh, you get basically a $500,000 gain that’s tax-free on your home. If you’re single, it’s 250,000. So pretty big number, and that’s above your purchase price. So if you were to buy a home for 500,000, sell it for 750, and again, that’s less some of your, your selling commissions and expenses, but you would have no tax on that, on
Tim: Mm-hmm.
Tony: gain. and it’s one of the few vehicles that you can ha- that you can use. Um, so the, you know, th- there is definitely some tax benefits from homeownership. Obviously, that’s to encourage more of it. But, um, you know, you ha- you can write off your interest that, that you pay. Your property [00:20:00] taxes are deductible up to a certain limit, and then of course, you have the capital gains exclusion for, for primary homes.
So, um, those are, those are definitely some strong benefits. And you, you are correct, Tim, there, there are costs that come up, right? You might need a new roof, a new AC. Those are things you have to look at when you buy the home. So if you buy a
Tim: Mm-hmm.
Tony: with an older roof, better be prepared in a couple of years you might need to replace that roof. So those are definitely things you have to consider when, when entering into, you know, homeownership. Because there are costs you, you probably wouldn’t have as a renter, you know, additional costs. Um, but, um, that I think it’s, again, one of the, the best savings tools we have is, is homeownership over the long run. Probably one of the best
Tim: Bring up the sale tax exemption within that, that $500,000 y- limit you mentioned for, for, uh, those who are married because I, I know there’s some nerds out there listening that are crunching numbers in the spreadsheet, and they hear a [00:21:00] 4% return, and they’re thinking about, ” Well, what if I instead, you know, invested this in a brokerage account or retirement account?”
And, and again, tho- those are important vehicles to, to round out our financial plan, of course, uh, depending on your situation, but we have to also consider the, the tax implications, right? If we, you know, if we’re putting money, uh, i- into, uh, something like a brokerage account, we’re gonna pay short or long-term capital gains tax when we go to pull that out.
And of course, if we’re putting it into more traditional accounts, we’re gonna pay, uh, ordinary income tax on the federal and the state level when we pull that out. So just considerations as you’re looking at all the financial, financial pieces o- of this decision. Yeah, and I would really encourage people, I mean, for those are, who are already homeowners, they, they know this just through lived experience, you know, where, uh, you, you go in to buy, and you’re thinking about the principal and interest.
You’re probably thinking about the insurance and the property taxes as well. But then it’s going through that first roof replacement, going through the first driveway repair, right? Going through the, you know, like we did, we moved in- [00:22:00] into a property in 2018 that we looked at the property in June, beautiful, like wooded area.
And then we get to the fall, and we see the leaves falling, and we’re like, “Oh, there’s a leaf maintenance piece to this. Oh, and, and caring for, for trees that die over time. That has a real cost, right? And things to think about there. And so there, there’s ways that you can run this math or at least estimate it to try to do more of an apples to apples comparison.
So, you know, yes, it’s gonna be principal, interest, taxes, and insurance. But you can also estimate, you know, w- 1%, 2% of the home’s value per year for maybe upkeep and maintenance. You can estimate, you know, what would the cost of a roof be every 20 years. You divide that right out by the number of months. And so you, you start to narrow this down a little bit, so you can, you can look at the full picture of what that home purchase would look like, which helps not only in the comparison, but also really helps in not being surprised, you know, when those, those things inevitably will come up over time.
Memories Over ROI
Tim: All right, let’s get off the quantitative [00:23:00] side of this for a moment and talk about more of the qualitative because it, this is one I, I think that Tony, when we bought our first house, this would’ve been in northeast Ohio in 2010, it was just Jess and I. Uh, and as I’ve shared on the show before, you know, your, your first home purchase, you never forget the purchase price.
$176,500, 2010, um, you know, four-bedroom house. Yes, it was more rural northeast Ohio, but those just don’t exist, right, anymore in the market. Um, and then we moved to Columbus in 2018, and we’ve been in that house, you know, ever since then. And when we bought that first home in 2010, before we then had our oldest son, who’s now 15, but he was born in 2011, I don’t think we were thinking about much of the qualitative aspects of, of homeownership.
Um, and, and not to suggest that kids have to be in the picture for you to have the, the qualitative benefits. That’s not what I’m saying, uh, at all. But for us, that was such a big piece of the puzzle, that, you know, once our oldest, Sam, [00:24:00] was born, and then eventually our second, our third, and our fourth, like, quickly the home…
When I think about the value of our home, you know, sure, I love the financial appreciation. I love it for all the, the reasons we just talked about, but when I’m going back looking through pictures, right, it’s the memories that we’re, we’re creating in the home. It’s the experiences. It’s the investment in, in remodeling our basement so that, you know, my, my oldest three can hang out and sleep there every night and, and get some good bro time, right, and have friends over.
And we have community that, that we’re in, and people that you just feel seen and, and loved by. And it’s all these other, you know, aspects that you can’t put into a home purchase calculator. Um, a- and th- this is why I, I so strongly feel that for those that this is a goal, if we really evaluate why is that a goal, well let, let, let’s prioritize that and, and build and look at the rest of the financial plan around it.
So from your perspective as somebody who walks people through every day, the [00:25:00] home purchase, the financing, how does this come up in, in conversation, right? Because pe- people are naturally focused on the spreadsheet. They’re looking at the interest rate. You know, they’re wanting to know the monthly payment.
But there’s this whole other side of the benefits of homeownership that I’m convinced when it’s all said and done is probably gonna be the piece that I look back and say, “Sure, it was great to get a few hundred thousand dollars of appreciation over time, but it was really these other things that I’m so glad we purchased that home.”
Tony: You know, it’s, it’s a great question you posed, Tim, because I’m always focused on the quantitative, right? Like my client cl- you know, “Tony, what do you think numbers, this and that, rates, payments?” the amount of times when I check in with clients or I hear from them, you know, whether it’s a few months, few years, even a few decades There’s so much positive, like I’m so glad we got that house.
I
Tim: Hmm.
Tony: I, I would say nine times out of 10 is we’ve loved it. I mean, there’s a few things here and there, oh, I didn’t… You know, we had to move or whatever. But the majority [00:26:00] of people “Man, I’m so glad we got it. Thank you for helping us get our dream home.” Like I’ve heard, I’ve heard that over and over again.
I’ve gotten thank you notes here, my team has, and it’s really rewarding to get
Tim: Mm-hmm.
Tony: and to see that. And it’s where, hey, we raised our family. We have– You know, we love our community. I mean, one big thing that I run into is school districts, right?
Tim: Yes
Tony: live in certain school districts, and that’s a make or break for a lot of families.
Uh, like the house is important, but we wanna be in this district for our family. And I, I find that that’s a big thing. Um, the other, uh, that, that comes back to me or I, I hear from people is saying like, “The main thing is we’re looking for a four-bedroom in this district,” and that’s what they tell us. Um, and, and cer-certain districts are more than others because of the quality of the school, you know.
Um, I, I would also say just growing families, and it’s not only growing with children. Um, I’m seeing more, uh, clients [00:27:00] call– I’ve had clients call this year their parents are gonna move, or
Tim: Right?
Tony: parent’s gonna move in with them. Um, you know, and, uh, that’s becoming more common. So it’s just hard to replace that.
Like I
Tim: Mm-hmm.
Tony: at, the, the home I live in and like the memories we have and, you know, m-m… I tease my wife, like I have three kids, and one’s gonna go to college next year, and I’m like, “Oh, we might need, you know, to downsize one day.” And, “No, no, no, no. We’re
Tim: No.
Tony: We’re, we’re gonna live here forever.
We’re gonna, we’re gonna live here forever.” That’s what I get, you know. But I look– I’d be sad if we were to sell it too, you know.
Tim: Yeah
Tony: same time, more quani– You know. But she’s just, “Hey, we’re staying here.” And, and then my
Tim: Mm-hmm.
Tony: is, you know, there’s so many memories and, you know, “Hey, I want grandchildren to come here one day.”
You know, I’m hearing that already. You know, like it’s
Tim: Mm-hmm
Tony: that kind of… Even though it’s way off, but I’m just saying that’s the kinda, the kinda things that homeownership brings that you just can’t get from a, a bond or a stock,
Tim: Hmm?
Tony: you c-can’t get that and, and [00:28:00] it’s… So that’s why I can’t put it completely in the investment bucket.
It is an investment. It’ll pay back over time, but you truly can’t value it that way.
Tim: Yeah
Tony: and, you know, investment properties is a whole another thing. We have a lot of people that call us for buying investment properties, and they can get good returns ’cause your renters are paying, you get appreciation. But when you’re living in a home, it’s completely different, you know. And, and I think, uh, genuinely, uh, the memories you make, you know, the pictures on the wall, the rooms you furnish, um, just the parties you have, it’s… Can’t replace that, right? There’s no price
Tim: E- even some of the headaches I would put in that category. As you were talking, I was think- I was thinking about, um, and this would be a pro- this would be a problem if it was a rental or our home, it wouldn’t matter. But, you know, in the past six months, you know, we’ve had f- four growing boys and their friends.
Inevitably, you’re gonna have stuff happen around the house, right? So we’ve had a soccer ball go through the dining room window. We’ve had, you know, uh, an elbow go through, [00:29:00] uh, the drywall in the basement because why not play hide and seek in the dark, right? We’ve had, um, a split, split lip that’s come from, you know, uh, the, the pole in the basement before we, you know, finished it.
And, like, you just think about all the different, um, memories and experiences. Uh, I remember early on, Tony, we… I don’t know if I shared this story with you or not, but we had a, um, water softener. We’ve never had that in a home we lived in previously, so it was like, right, kind of a new homeowner, don’t know what to do with that.
And, um, so we were kind of figuring that out, and then one day I go into the basement and I just hear, like, the backwash valve running. And I’m like, “Gosh, that shouldn’t be on all the time.” And sure enough, we get the water sewer bill and it’s like a $5,000 bill, right? ‘Cause they, the boys had been playing with it while they were playing in the basement and, like, you know, we had to handle that.
And thankfully, this water sewer company was gracious of like, “Hey, w- we gotta charge you for the water, but we’ll forgive the sewer.” And I’m like, “Thank you. I appreciate that.” And so, you know, even all of those types of [00:30:00] things are Jess and I will often joke about little quirks about the home of like, ah, we’ll get this fixed, or, you know, this, this happens here, or you just kinda know the nooks and crannies of your home.
Like, that’s all part of it. That’s all part of the experience, you know? And it’s just so hard to put that into a spreadsheet. Uh, it’s, it’s impossible to do that because even as you were talking about your kids or maybe eventually grandkids, I was thinking about a visual that often comes to mind for me, which is sitting around the dining room table for Thanksgiving, and at some point, like, the boys are coming back, you know, they’re not, not living in the house anymore.
They’re coming back as adult children. Maybe they have kids, maybe they don’t. But like, and just reminiscing about all the dumb stuff they did in the house , you know? Like, that’s part of all of it. It’s just part of all the value. And again, not suggesting it’s, it’s for everyone, but I think those are some of the hard things that when you’re thinking about an ROI calculator or you’re comparing it against saving in a brokerage account, like you just, you just can’t compare that.
It’s an apples and oranges
Tony: [00:31:00] Absolutely. You’re 100% right. That was funny to hear that, the, even the bad stuff, the drywall patches, the bloody lips,
Tim: Yes.
Tony: know?
Tim: Yeah.
Tony: Yep
Tim: And we, we’ve got a bad habit in our house of like we’ll, we’ll like look at something that needs to be repaired and like we, we know we’ll, we’ll take care of it eventually and then we like develop a workaround, right? ‘Cause you just get used to the workaround. And then you’re like, “Oh, why do we keep dealing with that?”
Like, let’s actually take care of that thing. And so but that’s become a fun connection point like for Jess and I of like we know that’s just a blind spot for both of us, you know? And so we like we laugh about it.
Tony: It’s a good thing you own because if you’re renting, goodbye security deposit, right?
Tim: Oh, gosh, yeah. Oh, well, long gone with. I don’t think… You know how they, like, uh, exclude certain dogs from rental properties, like pit bulls? I feel like my, my four boys would be excluded from a rental agreement, so high liability for sure. Um, this has been a lot of fun. I really enjoyed, you know, the [00:32:00] conversation where we could talk about both sides of the equation.
And my, my hope more than anything, it just gives people something to think about, whether they’re, you know, a first-time homebuyer, whether they’re, “Hey, we’ve been thinking about transitioning,” whether that’s to a second home or down- downsizing or retirement. Might even be bringing, you know, parents or in-laws into the home, as you mentioned.
Um, or for others, they, they might look at their current situation and they do a further evaluation and they’re like, “We’re good,” right? For whatever reason, the rent situation we’re in is good. Or, you know, I know many people that, you know, bought, bought a home they thought they were eventually gonna move, and they’ve been able to remodel and do some other things and, like, they’ve kinda made it into the property that works for them.
Like, that’s great, too. And so, you know, the, the point here is to be reflective about where, where does the homeownership piece of the puzzle fit into the broader financial plan, and how do we consider it both quantitatively, uh, and qualitatively? So Tony, as always, really appreciate your perspective and, and thanks so much for taking time to come on the show.
Tony: [00:33:00] Yeah, enjoyed being with you, Tim. It was a lot of fun. Always good to see you
Tim: before we wrap up, I wanna again thank Tony Umholtz, Senior Vice President of Mortgage Banking at First Horizon, not only for joining us but also for supporting YFP Gives as a lead sponsor. As we discussed today, a thoughtful home buying decision involves more than finding a property and securing a loan.
It means understanding how the purchase fits into your finances, your values, and the life that you wanna build. Having a trusted lending partner who understands the unique financial circumstances of pharmacists can be an important part of the process. Through First Horizon’s Medical Professional Loan Program, pharmacists in the lower 48 states can access up to 100% financing on loan amounts up to $2 million with no private mortgage insurance.
If you’d like to learn more about the program or connect with Tony directly, you can follow the link in the show notes or email Tony at tony.umholtz@firsthorizon.com. As always, we’re truly grateful to Tony and First Horizon for supporting YFP Gives and the [00:34:00] pharmacists we serve. Thanks so much for tuning in and we’ll catch you next week. [00:35:00]